In a fast-moving, often heated debate over whether President Donald Trump has upheld constitutional norms, conservative commentator Michael Knowles and liberal journalist Mehdi Hasan clashed over immigration, free speech, the Jan. 6 attacks, and the limits of presidential power.

The May 5 debate was the eighth installment in the Dartmouth Political Union’s Critical Discourse in the Age of Disagreement series and was co-sponsored by Dartmouth Dialogues. More than 300 people watched the roughly 90-minute debate in Cook Auditorium and more than 57,000 viewers have since tuned into the livestream.

Before the event began, organizers released results from a live audience poll showing that 78% of attendees believed Trump had not upheld the Constitution, while 22% believed he had.

A poll taken after the debate and audience questions showed support for Trump’s constitutional record rose modestly to 28%, while 72% still said he had not.

The debate opened with a foundational question from moderator Ella Klinsky ’26: What does it mean for a president to uphold the Constitution, and is that different from following constitutional norms?

Hasan, a British-American journalist and founder, CEO, and editor-in-chief of the media company Zeteo, said other presidents have violated clauses of the Constitution, but no previous president in modern American history “has launched a multi-pronged, across-the-board open assault on—forget norms—on the amendments and articles of our Constitution in the space of less than 18 months.”

“At this point, at this stage, anyone who tells you Donald Trump is not violating the Constitution is gaslighting you and/or a member of his cult, right? The facts are very clear,” Hasan said.

Knowles, an author and host of The Michael Knowles Show at The Daily Wire, countered that Trump’s actions must be evaluated in the broader context of American history, not focused only on the text of the Constitution. 

He argued that Trump’s actions fit within a long historical pattern of aggressive presidential power, including Abraham Lincoln’s suspension of habeas corpus during the Civil War, Franklin Roosevelt’s wartime actions, and Thomas Jefferson’s Louisiana Purchase.

“You know, if we were to use this very limited, pedantic, literalist reading of the Constitution, then we would have to disqualify virtually every single president we’ve ever had from upholding the Constitution,” Knowles said.

At several points, the debate became contentious enough that Klinsky intervened to restore order and enforce time limits. “Remember, we’re keeping this a nice, respectful debate,” she told the panelists.

Asked whether undocumented immigrants are entitled to due process protections, Knowles said they are in most cases, and argued that deportations carried out by the Trump administration follow historical precedent, including expedited removals authorized under immigration law.

“I’m happy that in this one case, we are in agreement—the illegal aliens deserve due process, and now that they have it, they need to get out,” Knowles said.

Hasan refuted that due process claim. He cited a recent study he said showed that between October and February of this year hundreds of judges across the country—a quarter of which were appointed by Republicans—ruled 4,400 times that Trump and his administration “were illegally detaining migrants in this country without due process.”

The two also sparred repeatedly over free speech and higher education.

Klinsky asked what role the federal government should play in promoting viewpoint diversity on college campuses. Knowles said he did not view viewpoint diversity itself as a central constitutional principle and defended Trump administration efforts to scrutinize universities receiving federal funding.

“I actually don’t love viewpoint diversity,” said Knowles, who graduated from Yale in 2012 with a degree in history. “I’m all for reforming the universities, which are failing in their chief missions.”

Hasan said the Trump administration had repeatedly targeted journalists, students, and critics in ways that threatened constitutional protections for speech and press freedom.

“This is the most anti-free speech, anti-free press, anti-viewpoint diversity administration in American history,” Hasan said. The audience Q&A brought some of the night’s most pointed moments.

One student pressed Knowles on whether noncitizen students have constitutional speech protections while studying in the United States. Knowles argued student visas are privileges, not constitutional rights.

“You don’t want to bring in foreigners who have no right to be in your country, who actively undermine your society,” he said.

Hasan responded by citing Supreme Court precedent protecting speech rights for noncitizens legally present in the country.

“There is no invidious distinction,” Hasan said.

One student asked whether Trump’s conduct surrounding the 2020 election and Jan. 6, 2021,  attack on the Capitol violated constitutional norms. Knowles described the Capitol attack as “very unfortunate” but argued that disputed elections and political unrest have historical precedent in American politics.

Hasan pushed back forcefully, arguing Jan. 6 represented a break from the country’s tradition of peaceful transfers of power.

“There is no precedent for Jan. 6,” said Hasan, who repeatedly pressed Knowles to answer whether he supports Trump’s pardoning of individuals charged in the Jan. 6 insurrection.

The debate also included discussion of military action in Iran and Venezuela. Hasan argued Trump violated both the Constitution and international law by authorizing military operations without congressional approval.

“It’s an illegal war,” Hasan said.

Knowles responded that presidents from both parties have long exercised broad military authority without formal declarations of war from Congress, citing actions by presidents from Harry Truman to Barack Obama.

“So, we can say that war is very bad and Trump shouldn’t be in Iran,” Knowles said. “But the topic at hand is whether or not Trump is within the constitutional mainstream, and at that, he’s actually quite moderate.”

Despite the verbal combat, Knowles and Hasan exchanged a cordial handshake at the end of the debate. The DPU last month featured a debate between former secretaries of state John Kerry and Mike Pompeo.